According to the release, the cuts are essentially the same as the proposal at the open hours, with 5 exceptions:
The proposal remains the same as presented at the April public hearings, except five lines (31, 63, 89, 152, 157) were changed to respond to rider concerns about connections to jobs, schools and other services.
34 responses to “TriMet Finalizes Service Cuts”
Geez, guys, could you vague it up a little more? What are the changes to the five lines you listed? WHAT is happening to the 63?
One of the changes in the new “essentially the same” list is to give the 36 as well as the 37 a 90 minute headway. This means that riders will essentially have to live their lives around the schedule if they use the service. There really is a point when it becomes a ‘why bother’ thing.
At least the 36 is still using Kelly & Hood instead of the Moody detour. It might get interesting if a significant number of commuters migrate from the 35 to the 36.
“Geez, guys, could you vague it up a little more? What are the changes to the five lines you listed? WHAT is happening to the 63?”
Have you attempted to click the link to the press release yet? Might be illuminating…
http://trimet.org/alerts/servicecuts.htm#detail
Of COURSE I clicked the press release. It illuminated nothing. That was the point of my post.
There really is a point when it becomes a ‘why bother’ thing.
I think I’ve heard that TriMet used to have a belief that, if a line is worth running, at least have it run hourly. But 90 minutes is better than nothing for people who are really helped by having the service.
…if a line is worth running, at least have it run hourly.
I’ve thought this myself. Also, it gives someone a good idea of when the bus is going to show up… as an example, if a route is hourly, and it arrives at the stop in front of someone’s house every hour at 7 after, then they only need to know the span of service in order to use it. Running service at something like 90, 80, 70, 50, 40 minute intervals usually requires knowing the bus schedule in order to use the service.
I can understand the “access” model where a small amount of service is provided for those who have no other option, but will even they be able to use it?
And yeah, the press release just has a little info, the page on the trimet.org homepage provides detailed information. (Oh, and clicking on the “Board Ordinance” link yields a 404 error. I wonder if even putting the link has anything to do with my stopping by TriMet HQ Friday night and asking for a copy.)
The cuts are pretty small considering.
But what will happen NEXT DECEMBER EH?
I don’t think we’ve seen the last of the cuts!
Today’s board meeting had the last chance to comment on the service reductions, and just about everyone who showed up and said something urged the TriMet Board to go back to staff without rubber-stamping the proposal.
I don’t know if TriMet ever posted Ordinance 306 on their website, but we now know the new route numbers of some routes if the proposal goes through:
24-Fremont
30-Estacada
31-King Rd.
50-Cedar Mill (new combined Cedar Mill Shuttle & 60-Leahy Rd.)
73-33rd Ave. (most people probably knew of this one, since it starts next month, and was announced several months ago.)
There are some other cosmetic changes, like changing the name of 75 to “75-Lombard/39th.” (the streets are the other way around with the current name).
(Since the district is still looking for cost-saving and efficiency ideas, I still like the idea submitted by another 74 rider to “break” the 75 and have every other 75 run through the Lloyd District before continuing from Milwaukie TC to St. Johns or vice versa, as well as the shelved idea of combining line 70 with what will be 73. Thanks to Jason McHuff who was also there and spoke in favor of this.)
These meetings are posted on my site and on Jason Mchuff’s web site btw.
http://rantingsofatrimetbusdriver.blogspot.com/
http://www.rosecitytransit.org/
Today’s board meeting had the last chance to comment on the service reductions, and just about everyone who showed up and said something urged the TriMet Board to go back to staff without rubber-stamping the proposal.
These meetings are posted on my site and on Jason Mchuff’s site btw.
I tried posting the links but got spammed out.
[Moderator: The comment with the links has been recovered.]
Thank you Mr Moderator,
AND, two PORTLAND TRANSPORT REGULARS speak at the
TRIMET BOARD OF DIRECTORS MEETING!
Link 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JChTsndaf2c
Link 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=caXfWeSQtpk
woops,
sorry,
wrong computer,
same guy,
don’t tell anybody!
Youtube is out of service by the way…
That’s OK, what I said came out totally wrong and not exactly what I intended to say. A bit more scathing to the wrong group of people, I have no intent of suggesting that TriMet or anyone else force the disabled from their homes. (That was actually one of the points made in Clark Co. in 2005, naysayers were saying “the disabled should be forced to move to Portland,” along with other various insults).
What I do know is if/when they cancel line 74, they are going to lose a lot of choice riders who ride it because they have either a transferless ride or a single transfer ride and aren’t willing to transfer all over the place when they can drive to work in less time than it would taking the “alternate service;” leading to further anecdotal grumblings of businesses that “nobody rides transit,” base(lessly) using only their own workplace for the research-less “research.”
I thought you made a good case for the 74!
It’s not easy speaking when you have FRED staring you down!
Oh yea, I forgot, thanks for the plug!
Over on the TriMet website, they’ve just released the new schedules starting May 24th. They include (you probably guessed it)–previously unannounced service cuts!
They’re also going to combine schedules for many routes (i.e., no more separate schedules for 19-Glisan and 19-Woodstock), making it tougher to differentiate when certain routes arrive downtown.
Jason Barbour Says: Over on the TriMet website, they’ve just released the new schedules starting May 24th. They include (you probably guessed it)–previously unannounced service cuts!
Specifically what, Jason? It appears to be a standard service change, other than shifting buses back to 5th & 6th.
They’re also going to combine schedules for many routes (i.e., no more separate schedules for 19-Glisan and 19-Woodstock), making it tougher to differentiate when certain routes arrive downtown.
How does combining the routes make it “tougher”?
Does eliminating service on Kelly & Hood by the previously unannounced relocation of the 36 to Moody count as a “service cut”? I don’t want to belabor this thing but it would be really helpful if anybody can find any reference to giving the public the opportunity to comment before the action was taken.
If you want to be picky or technical I think it would be correct to say that that 10 routes are going to be discontinued on the 24th. For example, Route 104-Division will be no more; however, generally the same service will continue as a part of Route 4. I’ll list my comments on this later.
Does eliminating service on Kelly & Hood by the previously unannounced relocation of the 36 to Moody count as a “service cut”?
Well, to many people coming from SE over the Ross Island Bridge, as well as those coming from the 1st & Arthur area, I think it would count as lowered convenience. However, I’m curious if they ever really planned to move just the 35 and not the odd rush hour Line 36 trips.
I’m trying hard to repress any latent conspiracy theorist impulses.
Moving just the 35 would give pretty good service to SOWA, and anybody who wants to continue on to the South Shore area could easily transfer at any stop south of Bancroft. Leaving the 36 on the current alignment would give at least minimal service to part of Lair Hill, but much more importantly would give through riders the option of saving seven minutes and possibly making an otherwise missed connection (78 or 37) in LO. It would also save TriMet a little money at a buck & a half a minute to operate a bus.
Who knows? The 36 might have even picked up a 100 plus current 35 riders. Perhaps most importantly of all, the 36 would have continued to beat the proposed streetcar extension for riders coming from the transit mall.
I’ll list my comments on this later.
Combining the routes does appear as having less bus lines/service if the pairs are now counted as two lines only get counted as one. In addition, transit tracker may be harder to use (especially via phone) if all of the inbound and outbound stops are a part of the same list. In fact, now you can punch in “104” as a route number and not even have to pick between “Fessenden” and “Division” (I used this with WES before it was formally added as an option).
More seriously, people will still get confused (and maybe more so) between the 4 on 5th Ave (to the Division half) and the 4 on 6th (to Fessenden). Yes, this kind of confusion can happen out on the middle of Division, but a lot more people start downtown and there’s the added confusion of all the other bus lines. Moreover, especially considering how downtown is across the river from much of the most heavily-served area, many lines don’t go straight out and instead can make multiple turns in crossing a bridge and whatnot. To get to a bus headed down Division, you need to know not only that Division is east of downtown, but that it is also south relative to downtown (and therefore travels south in downtown).
What I think could possibly be done is to make public the 1xx numbers. Its OK if new riders (who are subject to getting confused) don’t realize that the 4 continues on as the 104.
saving seven minutes
Is that seven minutes for riders going through the entire area (e.g. coming from downtown), or seven minutes for riders coming from 1st & Arthur (and possibly SE), who now need to make a loop up to Harrison Street and back to/under the Ross Island Bridge? In addition, it should be noted that there is direct rush-hour service from Marquam Hill to Lines 35 & 36 via Line 66, though I don’t know how much more time that takes compared to the tram (and remember, the ride DOWN on the tram is free). And that people can simply take the streetcar down to the south end and walk over to the 35 & 36 there.
If the 35 and 36 weren’t being moved, I would suggest having them use Kelly Ave. to Porter St. and then the ramp down to Hood Ave. This would bypass the horrible congestion of the 4 ramps/ 5 lanes of traffic all trying to get onto the Ross Island Bridge. Is stops were added on Kelly near Porter and on Hood near Curry, the only difference would be an additional ~1.5 block walk from 1st & Hooker (to Arthur).
However, I’m curious if they ever really planned to move just the 35 and not the odd rush hour Line 36 trips.
Someone from TriMet talked about this briefly at a streetcar CAC meeting back in September. There’s not much to go on in the minutes, which only mention the line 35. But TriMet was doing some kind of outreach, but I’m not sure what they did beyond that CAC meeting which I attended.
The seven minutes are added between 1st & Harrison and Hamilton. So it’s effectively adding nearly 25% to the peak trip from PSU to the Lake Oswego transit center. Similarly, the off peak addition of six minutes also adds about 25% to the same trip.
TriMet’s code requires appropriate notice, hearings, etc. if the route alignment effects 25% of mileage or more. This change comes nowhere near that, and time added is not a consideration.
We were given the opportunity to comment on the 35 change to Moody and the change of both routes to Harrison. I suggested to TriMet that the 35 Moody realignment be considered provisional, subject to review after a few months and again after the Gibbs pedestrian/cyclist bridge is opened. I made the mistake of mentioning that at least some riders would have the opportunity to switch to the 36 thereby giving a foot-based referendum on the popularity of the 35’s route change. That’s why I feel so sucker-punched on this thing.
Jason McHuff Says: Combining the routes does appear as having less bus lines/service if the pairs are now counted as two lines only get counted as one.
As we know, appearances can be deceiving. There will be fewer lines, but combining the route names didn’t change the level of service.
In addition, transit tracker may be harder to use (especially via phone) if all of the inbound and outbound stops are a part of the same list. In fact, now you can punch in “104” as a route number and not even have to pick between “Fessenden” and “Division” (I used this with WES before it was formally added as an option).
A vanishingly-small number of calls enter TransitTracker by route and for most customers, the use of the internal number would only have sowed confusion.
More seriously, people will still get confused (and maybe more so) between the 4 on 5th Ave (to the Division half) and the 4 on 6th (to Fessenden).
The current situation isn’t any simpler, really, which was exactly why the original Transit Mall relied on sector symbols. TriMet’s use of an identical number for two different routes is, I believe, unique in the US and only existed because of a much-outdated technical problem. The solution being used is to be clear about the destination of the bus (e.g. “To Saint Johns”).
Its OK if new riders (who are subject to getting confused) don’t realize that the 4 continues on as the 104.
It can be extremely useful information to know that the route starts at X and continues all the way to Y. Not everyone’s destination or origin is downtown. And looking at a map and timetable that clarifies that the 4 is really one long route can be very helpful.
BTW;
I’ve finally come around to thinking that rail is better than bus!
Why you ask?
With these budget cuts it has become very clear that the only services that are really immune to cuts are RAIL SERVICES!
Once the rails are in they are in FOREVER and will always be funded and operated.
All citizens in the outlining communities should immediately lobby their representatives to put in light rail and/or street cars on any route that could be vulnerable to future cuts.
For example, a street car that covered the ENTIRE CORNELL starting at Lovejoy and ending in HILLSBORO would be great.
A streetcar is necessary on 198th avenue in Washington county as well as FARMINGTON ROAD.
We do need to end the bus service and immediately put in street cars on every road that currently has bus service.
Then we can all relax, cause once the rail is in its in forever and is immune from any serious talk of cuts.
(aka THE WESTSIDE PATHETIC EXPRESS)
The seven minutes are added between 1st & Harrison and Hamilton
So that doesn’t include the extra time people coming from 1st & Arthur (or SE) would have to spend getting up to Harrison. And if going up to Harrison and back means a missed connection, that can add 30-60 minutes per trip because of having to take an earlier connecting bus or later Line 35. You could take the 43 south, but that doesn’t run real often and means an additional transfer from SE.
And moreover, I just realized that, you’ll not only have to go up to Harrison, you’ll also have to go over to 4th or 6th Aves, unless you’re lucky enough to get a northbound 43. In fact, looking at the new downtown stop map, it appears that you’ll have to go all the way to 6th & Market if you’re on the 19.
vanishingly-small number of calls enter TransitTracker by route
I do it a lot by route (over the phone) because I’m often not at the stop yet, whether I’m running to it or on a previous bus getting to it. I would like to just use the PDA interface and avoid the whole issue, but it takes effort to make an Internet connection from my Palm via Bluetooth and my phone and it keeps disconnecting.
the use of the internal number would only have sowed confusion
Well, yeah, but it is a nifty secret trick for those in-the-know.
It can be extremely useful information to know that the route starts at X and continues all the way to Y
And the maps could say “continues as Line 104-Division” just like they do now.
But right. For example, a person might desire to walk from their line (if they know they can) instead of transferring to one that gets them closer. And one thing I didn’t mention is that now there will be one timetable for the entire Division-to-Fessenden route, and people won’t have to juggle between two separate schedules.
But overall, it seems like the Fessenden route has nothing to do with the Division route, other then they just happen to be through-routed downtown.
Also, I’ve heard that Rose City Transit and maybe Portland Traction used to consider the two routes as one, with the signs always showing the final, outbound destination or route.
Hope that pain goes away!
with the signs always showing the final, outbound destination or route
From the late Alan Eisenberg on the oregonstreetrailways Yahoo! Group:
“When RCT interlined, the “outbound” line had the correct destination, but the inbound had the other end. Living near 33rd & Knott, it was interesting to catch the 33rd inbound with the sign indicating Holgate.
It was even more confusing at the birth of Tri-Met which had both lines on the same sign. Imagine trying to tell a visitor to catch the Broadway-Powell on 5th Avenue and they see it on 6th and head the wrong direction.”
Yes, buses now also show destinations, but “St. Johns” isn’t that clear for someone trying to just get to e.g. Emmanuel Hospital.
“And moreover, I just realized that, you’ll not only have to go up to Harrison, you’ll also have to go over to 4th or 6th Aves, unless you’re lucky enough to get a northbound 43”
The map does seem to show a 35/36 stop on Harrison between 2nd & 3rd. Also, it looks like the map ends at 1st without showing any of the stops there that far south.
R A –
I would imagine that the 35/36 stops beyond 1st would line up with the streetcar stops along that stretch, much as the 77 does along Lovejoy. Because the streetcar stops in the median, I’d anticipate bus stops lining up with the crosswalks.
FWIW, I commute on the 35 nearly every day during the summer, and at least last year, I didn’t observe that many people using 1st and Arthur as a transfer point. Most people I saw were waiting for the 17, not the 35.
a 35/36 stop on Harrison between 2nd & 3rd
Yes, but that’s useless if you’re on a bus coming from SE (or even 1st & Arthur) and there’s no stop for your bus near there.
I didn’t observe that many people using 1st and Arthur as a transfer point
Well, many people do get on in the affected stretch. Spring 2007 boardings, Fall 2008:
SW 1st & Lincoln: 28 / 15
SW 1st & Madison Tower: 2 / 5
SW 1st & Arthur (on island): 51 / 12
SW Naito Parkway & Hooker St: 5 / 4
SW Kelly & Curry: 3 / 7
SW Hood & Gaines: 2 / 3
SW Macadam & Hamilton Ct: 13 / 42
My concern isn’t about officially combining routes that are already combined–it’s about the small changes that look invisible until one notices.
For the last few years (at least), I know there have been some reductions during the Summer sign-up to account for less traffic to/from schools and colleges, however my concern this year is that these changes will be permanent.
For example, Line 44 goes down to 24-minute weekday service on the Capitol Highway portion and 36-minute weekday service on the Mocks Crest portion (they usually run every 15 minutes and every 30 minutes respectively).
Also gone are the 9-Powell-Limited PM Rush trips. 14-Hawthorne seems to have a much increased headways as well.