Passed on by regular commenter Ron Swaren:
An engineer has designed an electric bus that runs on battery power. Putting motors in each wheel makes a transmission and driveshaft unnecessary, and allows the bus to ride closer to the ground for ease of entry. Using stainless steel also reduces weight. The prototype increases fuel efficiency by four times over a more traditional city bus.
14 responses to “Bus of the Future – in Stainless Steel”
The company’s web site hasn’t been updated for almost two years. Doesn’t look promising…
And the article is dated July 1, 2007. There is a follow-up article from July 30, 2008. It quotes the same guy.
The bus of the future will certainly be electric motor drive, but it’s doubtful the motors will be integrated into the wheels because it exposes them (without shock absorbers) to the wear and tear of rough roads, torque forces, and the elements of water and road dust.
Buses today are required to do double-duty, full rush hour loads that include standees, and 1/4 capacity the rest of the time. Suspensions designed to handle this dual use is one reason today’s buses ride uncomfortably.
When buses integrate with light rail lines, their routes become simpler to define and avoid the shortcomings of designing buses for double-duty.
GM and Ford paratransit vans are long overdue for a complete redesign to be low-floor and utilize a hybrid drivetrain. Smaller buses are likely to be more common in the future, many with private operators.
I know the light rail does ride smoother than a bus—but when I have finished a bus trip somewhere in this Metro. area I have never thought back that “Wow, that ride was really uncomfortable.” What does bother me on a bus, is trying walk down the aisle when the bus is accelerating or decelerating quickly. On an express schedule that would not happen enough to worry about it.
I think the low-floor design would allow for an upper seating level, even if our city has not been planned for double decker buses…Don’t quote me on it/ Some routes would have a problem and low hanging tress are always a nuisance.
Volvo and BMW have been working on the inwheel electric motors. Maybe they have some solutions to the problems Wells mentions.
I just find it funny how we can send someone to the moon but we are just now figuring out how to make a bus lighter for more efficient transportation.
Ron, your logic is full of holes. Producing an even greater capacity bus to run on transit lines that need such capacity only during rush hours doesn’t make sense. Such a bus would be even heavier, meaning wear-n-tear forces placed on axles (and in-wheel electric motors) would be even greater. Sorry to have to bust your bubble, but… pop! Such a tiny little bubble.
I used to ride the bus to Hillsboro to monitor construction of Westside MAX. I hated that ride. MAX takes maybe 20 minutes less and always leaves me feeling good enough to walk around the old town center. Long bus rides are draining.
Wells wrote: Producing an even greater capacity bus to run on transit lines that need such capacity only during rush hours doesn’t make sense.
But that’s EXACTLY what we do with our rail system:
WES: $160 million investment, but COMPLETELY USELESS except during weekday rushhours. On a weekend (when Highway 217 is just as congested), WES doesn’t provide a shred of benefit.
MAX: Trains are always two-car trains regardless of whether the capacity is needed or not. An Oregonian study a couple years ago showed that trains leaving the downtown core during the A.M. rush hour were virtually empty…yet the trains MUST keep running due to the design of the system (whereas in many cities, express buses that aren’t needed during the day are simply parked until the afternoon rush hour).
I used to ride the bus to Hillsboro to monitor construction of Westside MAX. I hated that ride.…Long bus rides are draining.
Would that be because TriMet buys the cheapest bus around, with the cheapest bus seats around? Frankly, most of TriMet’s buses aren’t comfortable.
Ride a “real” bus sometime…Seattle’s buses are equipped with plush seats (not unlike those found on WES) and some buses even have overhead luggage racks and reading lights…in short they’re comparable to an Amtrak train in terms of passenger comfort. TriMet? Working hard to make your bus commute MISERABLE. (It certainly doesn’t help that TriMet refuses to buy high capacity buses even when warranted – it’s a daily occurence for 12-Barbur buses to be standing room during all hours of the day EXCEPT at rush hour (because of added service provided by the 94).
MAX is designed to travel regional distances with limited stops, and guide growth at stations. It’s not merely high capacity, Erik. Bus lines that connect to MAX stations may be shorter in length and better able reduce dual-use transit purposes and affect bus design accordingly.
I’ve been on plenty of buses with plush seats, that’s fine, but they still do not reach the comfort level rail offers. Tri-Met has to deal with seat wear and damage, which is more expensive with plush seats.
I’m all for expanding WES service to include weekends, if that will make you feel better. At any rate, out here in Beaverton, the trains are full going both directions in both morning and evening rush hours. Perhaps things are different for eastside or interstate Max–there’s a lot of industry out here on the westside, and lots of folks live downtown and work in Washington County. Many of whom ride MAX to and from the office.
Also, if you look at the MAX timetable you will notice that MAX trains run more frequently during rush hour than otherwise–Tri-Met certainly can and does park some of its MAX fleet during non-peek hours.
Why would you think that Tri-Met wants bus riders to be miserable? Are you suggesting that Tri-Met is trying to discourage bus ridership, in order to justify dismantling the system? I hope that you don’t believe such paranoid nonsense, but some of your comments truly make me wonder….
Wells wrote: Tri-Met has to deal with seat wear and damage, which is more expensive with plush seats.
Hmmm…WES certainly has some expensive plush seats; maybe we should be “equal service to equal users” and replace WES seats with the identical seats found on TriMet buses?
EngineerScotty wrote: At any rate, out here in Beaverton, the trains are full going both directions in both morning and evening rush hours.
I’ve been on a few WES rush hour trips, and both my experience and the experience of others who have done the same thing (as well as some regular riders) indicate the trains are NOT full.
How often does a WES train operate in which there are so many standees that the train legally cannot accomodate more riders? I get that on the bus frequently.
Also, if you look at the MAX timetable you will notice that MAX trains run more frequently during rush hour than otherwise–Tri-Met certainly can and does park some of its MAX fleet during non-peek hours.
Where does the train park downtown? Where is this secret MAX parking lot that nobody knows about?
The fact is that the train MUST run to either Ruby or Elmonica, even if the train is empty. And because of the design of the MAX signaling system, the trains have to run as “revenue” trains because trains cannot run through stations without stopping (else the train will get hit with a ATC penalty and go into emergency).
Yes, TriMet does run more trains – many of them are trains that start out at Elmonica, run as a Blue Line train to downtown, and then become a Yellow Line train. The trains are not parked as you suggest, they will run empty.
Are you suggesting that Tri-Met is trying to discourage bus ridership, in order to justify dismantling the system? I hope that you don’t believe such paranoid nonsense
You’re welcome to ride my bus with me and see what I see every day. I do believe it. I’m the one stuck on buses that break down, in uncomfortable buses with no air conditioning, at bus stops that are frankly unsafe, in buses that are at crush load…
It is a known, PUBLIC fact that Fred Hansen is opposed to any investment in the bus system. He has said so himself that he is opposed to higher capacity buses. He is opposed to bus stop improvements. He is opposed to improving bus routes. And he NEVER makes himself public for the very, very few token bus improvements that have occurred (Where can I find a picture of Fred Hansen with one of the new buses? I did a Google search of Fred and found probably two dozen pictures of him on a bike, on a MAX train, near a Streetcar, on/near WES – but NEVER, EVER on or near a bus.)
So unless you can irrefutable proof that TriMet is 110% committed to its bus system, I am only reflecting on my daily commute each day on TriMet’s bus system, namely the 12, 92 and 94 routes but also routes like the 44, 45, 54, 56, 76, and 78.
So unless you can irrefutable proof that TriMet is 110% committed to its bus system
Nice, ask people to prove the impossible. (Hint, you can only be 100% committed to anything.)
but NEVER, EVER on or near a bus.
“Fred Hansen rides the bus”
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jmchuff/3433721186/
Took me 15 seconds to find on Flickr.
Does it matter what we want anyway? Since Richard Trumka has been elevated to a national level as an Economic Recovery advisor, shouldn’t we ask what does Richard Trumka want us to do? (Please see photo.)
http://www.newsguild.org/gr/images/000915/Trumka.jpg
I wrote: At any rate, out here in Beaverton, the trains are full going both directions in both morning and evening rush hours.
Erik wrote: I’ve been on a few WES rush hour trips, and both my experience and the experience of others who have done the same thing (as well as some regular riders) indicate the trains are NOT full.
I was referring to MAX, not WES–my commute doesn’t take me near the WES line so I don’t get to observe it often. But MAX trains are full both directions.
Erik: The fact is that the train MUST run to either Ruby or Elmonica, even if the train is empty. And because of the design of the MAX signaling system, the trains have to run as “revenue” trains because trains cannot run through stations without stopping (else the train will get hit with a ATC penalty and go into emergency).
What’s the big deal? I’ve seen quite a few empty trains; and I’ve seen quite a few empty busses as well. Obviously, deadheading ought to be avoided as it is a waste of money, but there isn’t exactly room downtown to park a fleet of MAX trains. (And red trains heading west, rather than reversing at Beaverton TC, can simply deadhead to Elmonica–it’s only a couple miles down the track).
Erik: It is a known, PUBLIC fact that Fred Hansen is opposed to any investment in the bus system.
Where did Fred Hansen, or anyone else at Tri-Met, say this?
Erik: He has said so himself that he is opposed to higher capacity buses.
When did he say this?
Erik: He is opposed to bus stop improvements. He is opposed to improving bus routes.
When did he say this?
Here’s another article on an electric bus concept–in this case a diesel electric hybrid. However, it is not the lightweight, stainless steel design from Oakridge Labs:
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2009/03/26/dutch-e-traction-bus-combines-series-hybrid-setup-with-wheel-mot/