I only watched till about 2:30. Was there ever anything but peace and quiet? The fare machines (and ticket validators) are notoriously unreliable, though.

Also, it seems to me that fare inspections frequently happen at the same time of day in the same place. A friend of mine told me once that his fare was checked routinely on his ride home from work on the Yellow Line. In fact, they stopped checking him specifically because they became familiar with him and knew he had a pass.

I only watched till about 2:30. Was there ever anything but peace and quiet?

Mostly peace, but not always quiet.

Basically, the video boils down 3 hours of non-eventfulness into 13 annotated minutes.

At Hollywood, we witnessed a meeting between two people which might have been a drug deal, but have no evidence of that and there is also a reasonable alternative explanation. The hidden camera wasn't running at the time.

Another thing we noted in the video is that the new solar lights (to supplement pre-existing lighting) at 82nd Ave. are basically useless. We did encounter a pack of five rider advocates at that station, arriving from another train.

One more detail to add is that we always rode the rear car, which some people in past discussion have stated seems more dangerous to them.

Also, what if they piped in some muzak at the stations at night? The video reminds me how eerily quiet it and abandoned things can seem.

"Also, what if they piped in some muzak at the stations at night? "

THAT, is a freaking good idea!

Could get some live bands too.

God knows we have enough of them in Portland...

I remember riding the light rail in Pittsburgh, PA. They pipe in classical or jazz from NPR at the major stations. It was quite nice. I do not recall any other systems having such a "feature."

Wow, I can't believe you guys actually did this. I remember months ago in the comments section when Al proposed it.

Good work!

"Could get some live bands too."

W-O-W!

Another really great idea!

Turn the max stations into sort of 'carnival' attractions! Music and food!

That would actually be innovative!

I'm sure someone would find some obscure rule to shut anything like that down.

They pipe in music in lots of European stations.

(of course, Europe has 'grown up' while Amerika continues its struggle through adolescence.)

As a professional female impersonator that uses the MAX to get to performances, I can tell you that I have not had any problems in the 6 months plus I've been riding. At times the ride is less comfortable than others, but I have never felt unsafe, and I ride from Interstate to Old Town and farther at times.

"At times the ride is less comfortable than others, but I have never felt unsafe, and I ride from Interstate to Old Town and farther at times."

There is definitely no threat of imminent attack!

A lot of strange people riding, that's all. People basically minding their own business.

Its the same stuff you see on a main thorough fare like 82nd, downtown, parts of Sandy Blvd, etc.

It's uncomfortable walking in those area's late at night, and its uncomfortable riding the max late at night.

BTW-

Bob did all the actual work on this project.

I was just there.

It was interesting riding the max with that point of view instead of having some place to go.

Al -

Give yourself some credit -- you did all the non-hidden camera stuff, and encouraged the project to move forward.

well, ok, but thanks for doing all the grunt work bob!

Also;

I'd put you in charge of any project in any event.

When it comes to thoroughness and efficiency, I don't think I have seen anybody quite like you!

Certainly do a better job than I would do!

That much I know!

Al

A trip down memory lane --

It took me a while to find the original reference, but the idea of riding and making a video first originated in this flame war over at the Portland Tribune:

Pressure mounts for more MAX fixes (November 16th, 2007, comment Nov. 19th @ 8:01pm)

Then Al mentioned teaming up over here on PortlandTransport, referring to the Tribune article as the "other blog" ...
TriMet promises fresh eye on crime (November 20th, 2007, comment @ 1:57pm)

Could get some live bands too.

I'm okay with that, or radio, or whatever. As long as it doesn't drown out train announcements and what have you, it's not a bad idea.

As long as I'm posting, the video was about what I expected. A few loud kids is about the worst I've ever seen on a TriMet vehicle.

Er, maybe the likely homeless guys sharing a large jug of wine on the streetcar, but they seemed harmless. Quiet, calm, and probably smashed. Not a big deal.

Actually, the most interesting part of the whole thing was on my way to meet bob in downtown.

I left my car in Gresham and rode downtown on the max from there.

On that one trip, before the actual start of the project I encountered:

one panhandler;

one woman drinking booze in the seat across from me;

one guy got on the train and started boxing with the hand hold straps;

three Hispanics yelling at each other and
several really shady looking characters.

More action on the way to meet with Bob then the whole rest of our project.

More action on the way to meet with Bob then the whole rest of our project.

At least I haven't had dates which were critiqued thusly. :-)

But seriously, perhaps 9 trains on one night isn't nearly a representative sample. We'll just have to do this again sometime. I'll bring more quarters next time around.

oh jeez bob, damn!

As a frequent rider from the NE 60th stop, I attempt to validate tickets just about every day and fail just about every day. Usually with a maintenance van parked right next to me. I always call trimet to let them know - apparently especially with the bill acceptors and the ticket validators, there is widespread vandalism - people shove coins or other objects in the acceptors so that they stop working and they don't really have the manpower to prevent it or keep the machines in working order. Maybe trimet could develop less vandalism susceptible machines? I don't know how other systems have dealt with what must be a wide-spread problem.

Hi Allison -

NE 60th is also my main station -- I frequently report the machines there as well. As I'm sure you're aware, the machine on the right is also a quarter-hater -- if I have quarters the machine on the right refuses to accept, the one on the left can usually be finessed into taking them. These are both the same model and vintage of machine, so although I'm sure vandalism is a big part of the overall problem, there's also something about the adjustment of otherwise-identical machines that is an issue.

This is awesome, I watched the whole thing and hope you guys can do some more. Thank you once again for doing this.

I'm sorry, I hold TRIMET responsible for the failed ticket system.

They have no right to even ask people for fares without a 90% working ticket machine rate system wide.

It's a joke, like everything else.

The little guy gets screwed.

As usual.

The ticket machines are very unreliable. In the majority of cases (by just a bit), we encountered platforms which had either partially-functioning machines (coins only or bills only, exact change required, etc.) or completely out-of-service machines.

Bob, were you able to ascertain the reason(s) why this may be so? Vandalism, age, complexity? Does anyone have any suggestions for this problem?

My thought has been to develop a few different types of smaller, simpler machines that do one or two things well instead of the larger machines that can do everything (when operational), then have a ton of them at each station. Have 10 machines that just sell tickets. Have a few machines for passes. Maybe have machines that just give change, so the others don't have to have bill collecting mechanisms. When a machine develops a problem, there would be plenty of others to choose from, and perhaps the machines could be designed to easily switch out for functioning ones.

If the machines were smaller, simpler and cheaper perhaps some could be spread around to the larger bus stops as well.

Bob, were you able to ascertain the reason(s) why this may be so?

Well, thus far it's anecdotal ... but I've had more than one "little birdie" tell me that there are vandals at work on the east side, jamming objects into machines.

I have no direct evidence that it is true, but it has come to me from more than one rumor mill.

Personally, I think the age of the machines is also a factor. For one thing, they just plain don't like quarters since they started being issued with multiple designs. So there's room for improvement on the machine-design front, and perhaps something more vandal-resistant is now on the market.

It is actually quite important to quantify just how much of the problem is caused by vandalism -- if this is a significant issue, then multiple machines on a platform may not solve the problem.

Another idea is to put the additional redundancy on the trains themselves ... put compact ticket machines (similar to the repurposed parking meters used by the aerial tram, for example) on each train car. They won't take up much room, and offer redundancy which can be verified right on the train, and can be more easily supervised.

If the machines were smaller, simpler and cheaper perhaps some could be spread around to the larger bus stops as well.

I know that prior to the start of renovation, there were ticket machines at some bus stops on the transit mall. They were just like the MAX machines. One was located on 5th in front of Meier and Frank, as I recall.

All of the machines I've seen are labelled "MAX and Bus Tickets" -- it would indeed make sense to have them deployed to busy bus stops.

All of the machines I've seen are labelled "MAX and Bus Tickets" -- it would indeed make sense to have them deployed to busy bus stops.

As well as at major grocery stores, shopping malls, etc. They should be at ALL transit centers (even those that don't serve MAX) - doing this would speed up bus boarding and would even allow passengers to board/disembark using both doors (or if TriMet would use articulated busses, all three doors) speeding up bus boarding even more.

Doing this would also put transit "in your face" right next to the lottery machine or ATM, instead of having to figure out where to buy a bus pass at Freddy's or Albertson's or Safeway.

Another idea is to put the additional redundancy on the trains themselves ... put compact ticket machines (similar to the repurposed parking meters used by the aerial tram, for example) on each train car

You mean like these?

http://www.scheidt-bachmann.com/content/blogcategory/172/181/

I like the one in the upper left hand corner (the FAA-2000/CM) - about the same size of the machines on the Streetcar today, but they are full-featured (unlike the ones on the Streetcar). The "Farebox" would directly replace what TriMet uses on the busses today and offer the very same full-featured service, including use of mag-stripe cards (credit/debit cards).

All of the machines I've seen are labelled "MAX and Bus Tickets" -- it would indeed make sense to have them deployed to busy bus stops.

Bob, I should give you credit for your statement.

Thanks for your support.

:-)

Thanks. :-)

Regarding faulty ticket machines, I suppose we can count our blessings that TriMet didn't go high-tech too soon, as it's recently been revealed that the proprietary encryption scheme used in a number of RFID "smart cards", including those used in London's tube stations, has been cracked by university researchers.

(Yet another example of "Security through Obscurity" being foiled, causing widespread problems -- Open public-key encryption schemes are less prone to these kinds of attacks.)

Here's a YouTube video demonstrating how the security/access card of a random employee can be stolen and duplicated wirelessly, without the employee ever knowing, allowing multiple attackers to enter a building. The same technique can be used to duplicate and use a person's fare card:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NW3RGbQTLhE

Here's the technical explanation of what's going on:

http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~kn5f/Mifare.Cryptanalysis.htm

...I've had more than one "little birdie" tell me that there are vandals at work on the east side, jamming objects into machines.

I was thinking that we should promote the adoption of a contactless card system, so there wouldn't be anything to jam, but...

...it's recently been revealed that the proprietary encryption scheme used in a number of RFID "smart cards", including those used in London's tube stations, has been cracked by university researchers.

...so maybe that's not a super idea after all. :)

I'm not sure that whether RFID tags have been "cracked" is such a huge problem. Let's face it - ANYONE can counterfeit a $1 dollar bill. Two of them (and a common nickel or five pennies) gets you a ride on TriMet. It's only slightly more difficult to forge a credit/debit card, but it's relatively easy (all you need is a card blank, a "skimmer", and a magstripe writer.)

Frankly I would think that a TriMet operated RFID system would be MORE secure, given that at least on the bus system there's almost always someone there at the farebox. I guess a TriMet employee could install something that would crack it but what's the benefit to him/her - he/she already has free transit privileges for him/herself and their family. What is the loss if TriMet finds out that a tag has been cracked - simply deactivate the card. And you can still use other security functions with RFID (i.e. photo identification, non-duplicating watermark) so if there is a question of validity, a Fare Inspector could always check those two to make sure the card belongs to the person, and whether the required watermark (proving the card was issued by TriMet) exists.

I've had an RFID card for going on twelve years now through various employers for access to my worksite. I haven't heard of anyone stealing my card information in order to gain access to my building (or anyone else's, for that matter). Anything can be cracked; it's a matter of how bad does someone want to try, and whether the "reward" is worth it.

I've had an RFID card for going on twelve years now

The point I was trying to make was that it was a good thing that TriMet was NOT an early adopter of this technology. The exploit was only just discovered, and compromises a huge chunk of existing RFID security/payment infrastructure.

As I mentioned open public-key encryption systems are less prone to these kinds of attacks, because they can be scrutinized openly by a wide audience of experts as a system is deployed.

From what I understand of the current exploit, if you stand in a crowded area you can capture the signatures of dozens of cards as people walk past you, for later processing. An attacker could, given sufficient computing resources (which are cheaper every day), clone themselves hundreds of codes and use them disposably without being detected.

You are correct that there's not much incentive for a buck or two, but with annual passes costing hundreds of dollars, the incentive adds up.

If a transit agency figures out a way to detect and disable cloned IDs (for example, by analysing all trips for two that started at nearly the same time but from far-apart origins), it would inconvenience the legitimate rider. Further, to do so in real-time (to deny entry to a bus) would require a constant network connection between the bus and the database of bad cards. Otherwise, the database would have to be updated daily, and the hacker using disposable codes would never be inconvenienced, but the legitimate rider would be inconvenienced the next day.

Once the technology becomes more open and mature, I'm sure it will be fine for TriMet. I'm happy, though, that they're not having to replace tens of thousands of smart cards and reprogram readers system-wide, like is happening elsewhere right now.

If a transit agency figures out a way to detect and disable cloned IDs (for example, by analysing all trips for two that started at nearly the same time but from far-apart origins), it would inconvenience the legitimate rider. Further, to do so in real-time (to deny entry to a bus) would require a constant network connection between the bus and the database of bad cards. Otherwise, the database would have to be updated daily, and the hacker using disposable codes would never be inconvenienced, but the legitimate rider would be inconvenienced the next day.

Once the technology becomes more open and mature, I'm sure it will be fine for TriMet. I'm happy, though, that they're not having to replace tens of thousands of smart cards and reprogram readers system-wide, like is happening elsewhere right now.

Any form of "theft" is going to inconvenience the "legitimate" rider - what if a monthly pass is stolen today? There is absolutely no way for TriMet to block use of the stolen pass, and the "legitimate" rider has no recourse but to pay for a new pass.

When I receive my annual pass (okay, sticker) each year I have to sign something that not only acknowledges my receipt of it, but that if I lose it, >>I

As for being able to snuff out "bad cards", it doesn't need to be real time - a daily update would be sufficient. And I wouldn't deny boarding to someone with a bad card - I would tie in the RFID reader to the BDS, so that if someone used it the rider would be permitted boarding but an immediate call be put out to Dispatch advising of it. Thus the "bad card" rider would be caught by police (if he stays on board long enough), or at least the time of boarding would be "time-stamped" so that the surveillance camera recordings could be pulled to obtain an image of the user. If the rider has a tendancy to use the card over and over again on a consistent basis, then you know where to nab him/her.

Meanwhile, someone who has a monthly/annual pass using the RFID card would likely be registered with TriMet so if there is fraudulent activity the passholder can notify TriMet (if the card is lost) or if there is fraud detection (i.e. the same card ID is used near-simultaneously at two disparate locations) TriMet can simply call or e-mail the legitimate rider (who is known) and replace the card for them. Meanwhile TriMet can ascertain the ridership habit of the legtimate rider so when the legitimate cardholder uses their card the following day - the automatic alert will go out to dispatch, but the legitimate cardholder's trip is also known and dispatch will know *not* to dispatch transit police. (For example, my morning commute is on only one of three routes - 12, 45 or 92. If my card ID is skimmed and programmed into a new card, and someone tries to use it on a 35, TriMet would know that I would very likely not be on the 35, and a Transit Police officer could arrest whoever has "my" card on the bus I'm not on.)

See, not so difficult, I came up with that in three minutes.

The technology IS open and mature - I've been using this technology for 12 years. My employer (mind you, a major electric utility) hasn't announced they are replacing our cards. And our card system provides access to our electric grid control room (granted, MY card is pretty low access and won't get you anywhere close to the control room, but I have been in it once) and power plants. (I'm pretty sure TriMet uses some type of this access card for access to its garages and MAX yards - are they replacing their cards and readers)?

As TriMet has not already adopted this technology, TriMet has an advantage of securing a system with much stronger security.

If RFID is such a problem, one can always use magstripe (like NYCMTA's "MetroCard"). King County Metro's own passes are magstripe OR flash (depending on the type of pass), however they are going with RFID (http://transit.metrokc.gov/prog/smartcard/smartcard.html). The ORCA card is still in "beta test" and not all vehicles are equipped with the card readers (I believe the card functions as a flash card, like TriMet's passes, when boarding a non-RFID reader equipped vehicle.)

The technology IS open and mature - I've been using this technology for 12 years. My employer (mind you, a major electric utility) hasn't announced they are replacing our cards.

The exploit is fairly recent and is only now getting widespread publicity.

And our card system provides access to our
electric grid control room

If it uses the same chipset detailed in the exploit, they'd better start switching them out fast.

As TriMet has not already adopted this technology, TriMet has an advantage of securing a system with much stronger security.

I agree fully. That's why I mentioned that public-key encryption systems aren't as prone to these types of attacks. (When you go to a secure web site, for example, you are using a form of public-key encryption.)

You mentioned NYC's mag-stripe system known as MetroCard. There have been numerous people arrested for MetroCard fraud which is less wide-spread now because of upgrades and real-time networking of the various stations, but these were expenses incurred due to "unexpected" fraud.

For a brief summary:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MetroCard_(New_York_City)#Fraud_and_scams

Another story from 1999:
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F07E7D61130F93BA35752C0A96E958260

The above NYTimes article mentions a simple exploit made by physically modifying the card but doesn't reveal details. The exploit was later publicly revealed and wide spread, and involved creasing or destroying the mag strip at a position where certain bits of data would become unreadable and fool the reader into thinking the fare type was different.

Setting all the previous discussion aside for a moment, I think we are in agreement here but just talking past one another. I agree that TriMet needs to improve ticket selling and fare collection methods, and do so soon. I agree that card-based technology, if cheap enough to deploy on a TriMet-sized system, is an improvement over what we have today, especially for pass-holders.

I'm just very glad that TriMet didn't invest millions in the now-compromised RFID system a couple of years ago, which would just be adding a new scandal on top of the current problems.

The other interesting tidbit: The fare inspection netted zero violators. 100% of the riders on the car we boarded had a valid fare instrument, and there were no sudden departures from the car as the police boarded.

I've NEVER seen that except in the morning with regular commuters. In the evening I've always seem them net at least one or two riders and have a few scamper away. I'm with Al m on the ticket machine siutation though. It's a sad state.

Bob, were you able to ascertain the reason(s) why this may be so? Vandalism, age, complexity? Does anyone have any suggestions for this problem?

1. Don't design ticket machines using Windows 3.x. It was bad then, and is definitely bad now.
2. Utilize machines that aren't so bulky/absurd. Part of the problem is the physical design.
3. Utilize "people" more to sell tickets. With the absurd costs of these machines we could hire some basic ticket sellers just like newspapers have street sales people that hock the papers on the street.

Also mix the utilization of the ticket collectors to actually sell tickets too.

There are a million solutions on the table.